J.T comes clean about “negging” , White girls and what’s his end game.
Something I really wanted to ask you , and I’m being pretty candid here, but from what I’ve heard and experienced from other PUA I get the feeling that to them women were some sort of commodity there for entertainment. That makes me feel like an Xbox. I don’t want to be an non sentient object or just arm candy-
I don’t want my pussy to be just a way for you to feel better about yourself, you say that you teach self improvement but so many women feel the way I do about the Seduction community, what , if anything, do you think can be done to change our minds?
Honestly, you pointed out the term “Pick Up Artist” has a pretty permanent stigma associated with it. That’s something I always fight. People make certain generalizations and associations; I’m in this industry so I put down women, I hate women. No, one of the things we teach our Asian guys is go up to a beautiful woman and tell her she’s beautiful and get to know her. There are times during the weekend where we have all these women in one space and they’re being told they’re gorgeous, beautiful and sexy but more Asian men in one night than they have their entire lives. So for us we are no putting down women as a tactic, like negging-
What is “negging”?
Negging was something mentioned by Mystery. I guess he’s one of the godfathers of the industry and he had that TV show, – great guy, I love him, respect him. His tactic can be useful , but it definitely gave the Pick Up Artist movement a negative association.
Negging is a negative; you are intentionally giving a girl a backhanded complement to disarm her “bitch shield”.
I can see why people wouldn’t like that, (laughs)
(Luaghs) Yeah, it’s unfortunate, but the thing is it also works. I don’t use it all the time, but there will be a rare occasion where it’s called for where the girl is just being rude or something. Sometimes you have to be like, “hey you need to act like a lady.”
If she’s rude, then what’s the point if even continuing to talk to her?
Sometimes, they could be interesting and beautiful.
Right, but here’s the thing, a lot of women who are attractive get approached by a lot of guys. So they put up these shields in order to weed out the weak ones. Kinda like saying “if you’re not capable of handling me , you’re not capable of test you don’t deserve to be in my company.”
Let me give you this example, let’s say you’re walking along a Cliffside and you want to get up the cliff and you see a rope, what is your first natural instinct? Test the rope! You grab and pull to make sure it doesn’t break.
So being a bitch, or being bitchy is a protective instinct that women have, and I don’t blame women for that. It’s actually a good thing it protects women from the losers , freaks and guys that can’t handle her.
Well, as a chick, if I’m being mean to someone it’s because I have zero interest in them, the more you talk to me the more you’re just going to piss me off.
Well at that point, the man has failed.
I was raised in a different culture I guess, I was raised not to ever give your number to any man that comes up to you on the street. So I always feel bad for guys that do that hit on me, even if I find them attractive I’m not going to give them my number or engage them I’m just going to keep it moving. Does that give me a bitch aurora?
Well if that’s the way you were raised, you really can’t say that you’ve never given out your number-
No, I really never have.
So you’re telling me that you go to a coffee shop or grocery store and there’s a cute guy who’s very sincere-
Nope, never done that.
Okay, that kinda different.
Yeah, I’m a weirdo.
Most women will give out their number even if they aren’t that interested in the guy. This is something people ask me about all the time-“Why would she give me the number if she’s not going to pick up the phone?” It’s because women in America, and most places, are taught by their parents and society to be nice. Don’t ruffle feathers or be mean to people, so even if they’re not interested women will give out their number so they’re not mean to men face to face.
That’s an answer to what a lot of guys take issue with, they get a number but the girl never picks up.
Unless that chick is me and I just say ,“No”
(Laughs) Well how do you meet men?
Usually it was, people I met through school or someone that I was in a situation where I repeatedly saw them. So it was just like “Hi potential date rapist, here is my number.”
That’s what we call social circle dating. That’s generally where most people will find their girlfriend. The cold approach is actually pretty uncommon most people meet their mate in a sort of social setting.
Are you teaching guys how to find life partners or how to hook up? I mean you can go on craigslist and hook up for free.
Well the Internet is a lot different for Asian guys, especially if you’re doing interracial.
Yeah, (laughs) I’ve been to those, they’re (pause) whatever. To answer your question, I keep neutral in that regard. I do think if you’re going to find the woman of your dreams you have to become the man of her dreams. A lot of the men that get into this don’t have a lot of experience with women. One of the elephants in the room, so to say is that for a man to have confidence with women he needs experience. Experience in dating or in bed, he needs to have exposure.
I’ve been doing this for five years and have guys emailing or I see them on Facebook and they’re married now or have been with the same woman for years. We had one guy I remember from San Francisco, he met his girlfriend on the third night of a program and they’ve been dating for the past 2 years.
Guys getting into this sometimes believe that they just want a hook up a lot, but as they acquire more of the social and sexual experience that desire changes. They want to find “the one”.
My guy William, who runs the better Asian man, when he got into he, was like 30 and he was just so done. He was ready to give up on America and move back to Taiwan or Hong Kong when he started the program. He got his first successful hook up on the second night. So he just thought this is what I want to do, have hook up after hook up, but after about six months he started settling down with one girl and eventually thinking about marriage. He transformed from being a player to someone that can think about the long term.
Another guy I remember was this Korean virgin who ended up marrying a black girl he met in a New York coffee shop.
Each guy getting into this has different goals, and I’m not here to judge I’m only here to provide the system, foundation and support that they need to acquire that goal.
Since you brought up sex, I’m curious what do you teach your students about sex and sensuality? You know what blog I’m interviewing you for, so spill.
Well, we’re predominantly the pick up portion if you will. I mean there’s something we talk about called “last minute resistance” to make sure there are no reservations at the end. We give some basics on sex ed., always making sure that you wrap it up and things of that nature. The actual sexual techniques one thing we stress is foreplay, at least 30 to 40 minutes just on her. Especially guys that are less experienced and might be one-minute men. The best way to be invited back to have sex is pleasing her.
We’re not really a sex ed. Industry though there are those that specialize in that particular portion.
Good job, I’m sure a lot of women out there should be thanking you for that. Most women won’t be able to cum without at least 20 minutes of continuous stimulation. Thumbs up to you, sir.
Now to jump subjects a bit I wanted to ask about, I guess the racial representation of women in the PUA community. I’ve notices in a lot of the sites, especially those targeting Asian men, there seems to be a point to show Asian men with a very specific type of woman. She’s tall and blonde. I remember when I was younger seeing sites like “Better Asian Man” and thinking I guess the only way for Asian men to be better is to snag a white chick. Is there a particular reason you think for this being a prevalent image?
Well in the larger PUA community they don’t really racialize it, but I have noticed is a lot of “Pick Up Artists” do is they’ll target Asian girls, because its easier for white men to get with them. I know that’s not always true all the time, but because of the social hierarchy there is that factor in play. The reason why we emphasize it is because it IS more difficult. Guys might say we’re just reinforcing the stereotype but one out four Asian girls don’t marry Asian guys, that’s not including the rate of Asian girls that are cohabitating with someone non-Asian.
The marriage out rate amongst Asian men is, I forget the statistic but it’s the lowest among any group. [Author’s note: In 2008, 20% of Asian men married non-Asians, but 9% of Black women married non Blacks, making them the lowest of any group.] The statistics show that Asian women outperform Asian men sexually, they lose their virginity earlier, go out on more dates, have more sex partners on average than Asian men. Again you can say I’m reinforcing the stereotypes but that’s true, regardless of if I say it or not.
There’s a lot of Black women who are single and there’s not as much, you know, and when you see a lot of programmes that are supposed to be for men to get together, it’s still not as racialized as I see the Asian pick up community where it’s like if you look at the website, they pretty much make a point that there’s going to be a blonde white chick on that website, maybe a brunette maybe. You talk about the social hierarchy – do you think that’s just a remnant of it?
There’s two aspects of it, Asian on Asian game normal, and doesn’t really require an extra skill set, other than being a normal, confidant guy. As a result of the social hierarchy, certain disparities and biases that exist for an Asian man to go outside of his race it requires a higher-level skill set. It’s not because Asian men are lacking but because society has this inherent streak of prejudice, seeing Asian men at a lower level. I remember reading that in Black churches, Black women are encouraged to only court other Black people.
That article, I believe I know the one you posted a while ago. I think that was more saying that Black American women are too religious for refusing to settle and marry a man who isn’t as religious as them, which is pretty hard to find in this country.
The marriage rate of Black men is pretty high; it’s comparable, if not more so, than Asian women. I also know that for Black females there’s certain dissatisfaction with that status quo. Like ‘White girls are taking the Black men’. So you have to ask yourself would it not be in their better interest if Black women were expand their horizons to include other men and races.
If that’s their choice, but as a Black girl, you could expand your horizons all you want, doesn’t mean that anybody wants to join you on that journey. I’ve fucked a lot of Asians dudes… haven’t met a lot of their parents.
I absolutely agree. My parents are pretty racist – at least my stepdad is. So you’re absolutely right in that regard. But I also know that for Asian guys when we tell them to ‘Go up to that Black girl and tell her she’s gorgeous’, in a certain way there’s a lot more resistance to that. It’s not because of social hierarchy, more like a Black girl is definitely not going to like an Asian guy. Every time they do it and it works they’re incredibly… they’re more surprised by that than when a White girl responds very positively. There aren’t that many White/Asian role models if you will – media imagery reinforcement. It’s almost non-existent when it comes to seeing a Black girl liking Asian men.
In all my experience, they have a perception that Black girls do not like Asian men. Whatever prejudice you believe that a White girl has against Asian men, it’s double for Black girls. Sometimes you have to put it out there, there’s always going to be a certain amount of prejudice. One thing about Asian guys is that they feel that Black women are definitely not for Asian/Black couples until they actually experience it for themselves.
You did bring up a really good point with Asian male perception of their options when it comes to dating. What do you in particular do that helps Asian guys just be able to get out there?
Out in the dating scene?
Yeah, you mentioned the media and a lot of other societal forces, do you think that just inherently discourages Asian guys from dating?
Yeah, I mean again this is a very complex subject and there’s a lot of internal and external factors at play. The only part of the Universe that you can be sure of improving is yourself.
You can worry- I know so many Asian guys, especially when I was in college and so I got talking to other Asian guys and becoming like that bitter angry Asian man. Like ‘Goddammit, the media is always putting us down’ and so you end up just staying on form and angry and bitchy and just not being productive and participating as a member of society or when you do…
Yes, so it’s like a poison to your confidence. It’s like a virus, I mean the more you think about it, the more it’s going to undermine your own confidence. Unhappiness with yourself, not only with yourself but other women and people in general. You know, instead of being like a positive influence, like an interesting and like we said fun up artist, you are being angry about something that you have no control over. The only thing that you have control over 100% of the time is you.
So you know I think the big thing of taking guys out there is… like you know the programme, we kind of specialise in Asians, but I want to make a note that we don’t you know… like over 25% of our clients are non Asian, from Black to White. In our programme itself, there aren’t a lot of “Race tactics”, the game itself is not particularly different. You simply have to game harder and game better because you have like this prejudice in society. It’s a small prejudice, but it exists and it exerts an influence upon us.
So there are particular tactics as an Asian guy – you have to be different or you just maybe sometimes have to be better. One of the big things is when a guy, when a student, they see like me or they see like one of my coaches who is Asian and not necessarily tall and good looking being successful with a woman, whether she’s White, Asian or Black, that right there is pretty much the eye opener and they’re like hey if he can do it, I can do it. Because dating is an oral tradition, you know passed down from the father to the son, the brothers or whatever, your male peer group. You look at different cultures, whether they’re Italian American or African American, there’s a certain inherent dating knowledge that’s passed on, as opposed to like for Asian Americans where that isn’t passed on.
There is no way that my stepdad could teach me anything about how to pick up a girl here in America. There’s nothing that he could tell me that would be absolutely of any help. I think that’s true for a lot of us whose parents were immigrants. So, you know that oral tradition is broken. When they see me being successful and not caring that people are judging me and caring that White guys are staring me down or Black guys are staring me down.
You’d be amazed at how many guys are mad dogging me if I’m with a Black girl or a White girl – it’s amazing. But you just don’t care. The magnitude of your success is equal to the magnitude of your haters.
Maybe I’m a weirdo, or because I’m in the NYC Metro area, but whenever someone asks me ‘Don’t you feel weird dating an Asian when people are staring at you?’ I’m always like… If I’m with a guy and I’m paying more attention to the people staring at us he’s not really worth being with. Also who the hell is staring everyone’s a mutt over here.
Yeah that’s true to a certain extent. Well, when I was living in Texas I’d be kicked out of clubs, not so much in Dallas, but rural areas like Fort Worth. I decided that I just need to leave. Those guys did not want me there with those girls.
I guess you’re a little more cosmopolitan and worldly in that regard, but there’s a lot of pressure on the guy. It’s simply a sign of respect. There’s been time where I’ll have things going well with a girl and I’d walk away to use the restroom and these guys would just descend upon her. They’re thinking ‘If she liked that short Asian guy she’s going to LOVE me’, and there’ve been scuffles. Simply because some tall good-looking white guy thinks he can obviously out compete me.
I know you look at it from your perspective, but from the male perspective there’s always going to be competition and it gets worst the more beautiful the girl is.
I guess as a female, I usually look at how a guy reacts to other people- like I was on this date the other day, sweetest man I’ve ever met –I took his virginity and he was like 36-
(Laughs) wow, good for you.
Oh, if I had a “Just took his virginity” punch card it would be full two times over, but when I went on a date with this guy, there was a crazy New Israelite Black Panther dude with a yarmulke and dashiki on screaming at us as we walked by. Calling us slurs and what not and I looked at my date and I sort of felt like; if he didn’t say anything or react he’s not worth it in the long run. Sadly he didn’t, I guess that was a “lady test”.
Yeah, it was.
I still adore the guy anyway, I’m weird.
I wish I understood more female psychology. Like I said its part of the art, there’s certain things women expect of you. In those situations its hard to judge, you can say to yourself, ‘if I say anything I could exacerbate the situation’, and no one wants a violent confrontation. If someone is willing to yell like that on the street… You have a split second to weigh all the pros and the cons.
Unfortunately for me my reaction is to yell right back, so I’m sure I failed his “Man Test”. I felt really bad afterwards when I realized I probably just emasculated my date.
Yeah… especially if you’re throwing in the race factor into an already merky situation. Dating is complicated enough then you throw in the race stuff. In a minefield, what can you really do about it?
Well, I don’t know if it so much psychology but the mood of the girl. I used to be engaged to a Native Korean … we were walking down the street in my hometown and some dude yelled out something slick. My man’s reaction was to punch him in the face. I was not happy about that.
(Laughs) Guys just can’t win with you can he?
(Laughs) Well I was much younger, not used to violence. It depends on the girl. I think there’s more too it than just one psychological reaction for women.
Like I said from the very beginning, as much as we study psychology to get better at this, every woman is an individual. There’s a thousand different variables that controls, your likes, dislikes there’s not science behind it. One of the mythologies of the community is that you can practice game and you can automatically get any woman you want. The reality is pretty far from that. You don’t learn Jedi mind tricks. I think its more healthy to look at it as becoming a better man so you can be with the women you want to be with. So if you want to meet Mrs. Right or Ms. Right-Now its about being a better man.
Sounds like a healthy outlook, I’ve thought that it would be sort of soul crushing for a guy to pay thousands of dollars for a boot camp or books and then run into a woman like me. If I don’t like you there’s nothing you can say or do. I don’t like you. I know within 5 seconds of talking to you how I’m going to shoot you down.
Exactly. The battle is won before it’s even fought. The attraction happens before you even open your mouth. Its how you act and the mental process. For those guys that aren’t experienced it’s a revelation. Guys always focus on , what to say , like what lines to use in reality its not that important. You need to just be able to talk.
For instance when I made the cover of AsianWeek, one of my clients was Singaporean so he had this accent-
I love Singaporean accents, they are so fucking sexy.
(Laughs) Well he had this accent, and I tell him to go up to a girl and tell her “You’re fucking adorable.” And he did it with his accent and you know it works. For a lot of Asian guys where English is not your first language it’s harder to master that flowing banter like conversation. So you have to more physically convey that fun, that energy and that confidence. So your game is more through the words that are unspoken.
What is your goal with the ABC’s of Attraction?
Well here’s an interesting statistic in 2020, there’s going to be 20 million Asian men with no hope of getting a bride because of the Chinese one child policy. So can you imagine the social pressure of those men who never had a girlfriend going out to Russia, or South East Asia or Africa. On a social and sexual level, I think it was Russia that was trying to raise a law anti-miscegenation laws that would bar Chinese men from marry Russian women.
Well I know countries like Israel and a few others actually already have that law, America used to have that law.
The point is there’s this huge pressure that’s building up. There’s never been 20 million men in history that could not get a wife. There’s not going to be enough Chinese women to go around. I want my company to expand for that.
So you want to be in China by 2020?
Yeah, there’s not even 20 million Asian Americans. I would also like to go into general self-help. There’s a lot of issues that Asians deal with that aren’t touched on by the general population.
In the immediate term I’ve been working on my book. Its about 200 pages I’m finally getting back to it. I’ve been in this industry for five years and my company doesn’t have that many products to sell. We’ve been very focused on services, instead of products but there’s been such a demand that we’re trying to satisfy that as well.
We try to make our program for everybody even though we are minority owned and operated. I think we have a great understanding of racism and how to deal with it. We want to help Asian Americans be more successful, you can’t change what the media says about you, you can only change what you do in your life and how you deal with people.
90% of the non-Asian girls that I’ve dealt with romantically or sexually have never been with an Asian guy- not because they were against it but because no Asian ever talked with them. I’d like to think we are encouraging this generation of Asian men to be successful and to be confident. So the next generation won’t have the same problems.